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Roses
May 26, 2011 18:53:36 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 26, 2011 18:53:36 GMT
The mycorrhizal fungi has not been around for many years and it is quite expensive. It is not just for roses either, and I understood it was only needed in certain conditions. In fact Peter Gooch of Thorncroft Clematis is only just now experimenting with it. Your thin soil may be one of these special cases Grindle, but I am requesting expert advice on this. I was introduced to it at Fryers Roses of Knutsford. You're right it is expensive considering it's natural and has been around since time immemorial. Fryers now make their own version. I don't think they make it Merlin. As all the rose companies do, they have it packaged with their brand on it. The soil does contain this already in its natural state. Roses are not too fussy, but are a bit greedy. 'Rose Sickness' or 'Replant Disease' is understood now and largely overcome. I still keep an open mind on 'rose sickness' though as I don't believe it's due only to soil depletion.
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Roses
May 26, 2011 18:55:17 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 26, 2011 18:55:17 GMT
That is twice I have used 'quote' and it has come out wrong. Oh well.
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Roses
May 26, 2011 20:43:06 GMT
Post by merlin on May 26, 2011 20:43:06 GMT
That is twice I have used 'quote' and it has come out wrong. Oh well. So, is it a "sickness" or because the previous rose has depleted the soil of goodness?
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Roses
May 26, 2011 21:06:18 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 26, 2011 21:06:18 GMT
Trace elements would be exhausted after about ten years and minute eelworms could add to the problems. This would not be evident with the rose which was grown there before because this could have adapted to those conditions. It is never advised to put a plant of the same type where there was one previously for a few years.
I was advised by the head man from Classic Roses that if I had to plant a rose in the same place, which I don't, fill a wine box with good soil and drop it in the generous hole. Plant the new rose into this, and in this case, use the mycorrhizal fungus. The box would have long rotted and the soil would be good when the rose grows out of it.
This sounds like a good plan in Grindle's garden to me. But I expect some advice to come back on that.
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Roses
May 26, 2011 21:13:29 GMT
Post by merlin on May 26, 2011 21:13:29 GMT
I agree with that in fact I did just that using a large cardboard box filled with fresh soil.....and used micro wotsit. Before hand I watered the hole with Armatillox. It worked
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Roses
May 27, 2011 5:48:26 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 27, 2011 5:48:26 GMT
Merlin, I nearly fainted. You agree with that? We are agreeing on something. ;D
As you have actually done this you will have to tell us more about it. Why did you do it? Did you plant a rose in a place where there had been another? I would probably put some home made compost in as well and I wonder if you did this.
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Roses
May 27, 2011 6:20:32 GMT
Post by merlin on May 27, 2011 6:20:32 GMT
Cherry we agree on most things, except maybe TV presenters ;D As I love Roses and don't have enough space I have had to replace roses in the same place. I've done it several times and that's why I understand the problem. A rose will not flourish where another rose has been especially if it was old. My first attempts were all failures but now I take the problem seriously and tend to be OTT when it comes to replacing the soil. It's folly to try and take a short cut as it takes a long time to know the outcome which WILL be a waste of time. I dig out the old rose and remove an enormous amount of soil down two spits at least. Water the hole with Armatillox. after a couple of days I plant the new rose with soil from somewhere where there has been no roses or use fresh Tree/Rose compost. As I said earlier, I still suspect that there's something in the soil that unless totally removed, ruins your new rose. To give you an example, My Sister's friend replanted an entire rose bed, a big one. They all failed. I asked him did he replace the soil. He said yes but only around the roots. He has now planted other plants.
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Roses
May 27, 2011 6:34:15 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 27, 2011 6:34:15 GMT
Merlin, if we can get Grindle sorted with a beautiful rose of her choice, we will have done a good job. I am not too worried about WF because her soil appears to be more suitable and deeper in fact. There is good advice in your post because you have actually done this and it has worked.
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Roses
May 27, 2011 18:59:43 GMT
Post by wildlifefriendly on May 27, 2011 18:59:43 GMT
I am not too worried about WF. You have more faith than us we wandered along the rows of roses at the GS, We sniffed a few that were the right colour but smelt of nothing, smelt some heavenly ones which were the wrong colour, we didn't like the ones with loads of little flowers or the ones with huge blousy flowers and the others were just green so we bought a fern
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Roses
May 27, 2011 21:24:31 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 27, 2011 21:24:31 GMT
That is just what you should do WF. You must look at all of them and find one to suit you. I am glad you are not rushing into this.
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Roses
May 27, 2011 21:32:00 GMT
Post by wildlifefriendly on May 27, 2011 21:32:00 GMT
One day I'll find one we love AND will suit our ground AND which Cherry will approve of for quality and strength.
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Roses
May 28, 2011 5:07:18 GMT
Post by grindle on May 28, 2011 5:07:18 GMT
:)this is all very interesting, and I'm learning a lot thank you
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Roses
May 28, 2011 6:34:56 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 28, 2011 6:34:56 GMT
One day I'll find one we love AND will suit our ground AND which Cherry will approve of for quality and strength. No no! You must plant to suit your own tastes and you have to work out strength, etc., yourself. I am not an expert. We are doing this together. I make mistakes. I really mean that. I am most impressed with Merlin's planting actually. I have known about this system for two years and have never mentioned it before in case you all thought I was mad, but Merlin has used it and it worked. Sweetpea and I have favourites and it is an old Bourbon rose called Zephirine Drouhin. In your area it may get blackspot, but there won't be much better. It is too windy for blackspot here, so fungal diseases don't take a hold. It takes two or three or more years before it starts to climb, but it should climb and is worth the wait. No thorns, gorgeous too.
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Roses
May 28, 2011 6:36:33 GMT
Post by grindle on May 28, 2011 6:36:33 GMT
This is the one I bought last year Cherry, and so far it's doing well ;D
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Roses
May 28, 2011 6:39:35 GMT
Post by Cherry on May 28, 2011 6:39:35 GMT
This is the one I bought last year Cherry, and so far it's doing well ;D I know Grindle, and I just love it. I have seen its sport Kathleen Harrop growing beautifully, but it is harder to get and I have heard it is slower to kick off. I have also seen ZD growing as a big bush with no pruning. It was still beautiful but I like it better when it climbs.
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